Tactics for Working with Difficult Leaders

Navigating the maze of corporate leadership? We've got you covered with our latest chat on wrangling with the complexities of managing difficult executives. Today we share practical insights on navigating difficult executives.

In this episode, we discuss building a support system, examining the bigger picture, and strategically picking your battles in the workplace. With a blend of anecdotes and humor, we'll offer actionable advice for professionals at any career stage. Tune in for a fresh perspective on workplace challenges and discover how to transform your approach to difficult executive relationships!

In this episode, we discuss the following:
1. The value of building a support structure around you when dealing with difficult executives.
2. The importance of stepping back and examining the bigger picture when faced with a challenging executive
3. Learning how to be strategic and discerning about which conflicts to address.

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CONNECT WITH SUSIE:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/susietomenchok/

CONNECT WITH JAMES:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/capps/

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:15

Welcome to the Quick Take Podcast, the show where you get targeted advice and coaching for executives by executives. I'm Suzy Tominczuk.

Speaker 2: 0:24

And I'm James Capps. Give us 15 minutes and we'll give you three secrets to address the complex topic of issues that are challenging executives like you today.

Speaker 1: 0:34

Hey friends, hey Quiksters, Welcome. I'm Suzy Tominczuk, along with my co-host, james Capps. As you know, we're just you. Call us Suzy and James. That's it.

Speaker 2: 0:46

That's right, we're the.

Speaker 1: 0:48

Wonder Twin powers, Wonder Twin Boom. All right. So, James, today I talked to a client of mine. Just got off the phone, Literally, just got off the phone. Literally, you heard me just get off the phone.

Speaker 2: 0:59

I did, you hung up.

Speaker 1: 1:01

I was there, you were there. They wanted to get some advice on how to handle a difficult executive and what to do, and there's so many things about that. I thought what a great topic for us to dive into today.

Speaker 2: 1:15

Yeah, that's a fun one, and I think by difficult executive. I think with the conversation we were having was there are people in positions of authority and power that are sometimes really challenging, and it's one thing. When it's one of your peers or somebody on your staff, I think that's a different animal. But we're talking about somebody who is maybe your boss's boss's boss, or perhaps the leader of a division that you really don't have direct influence over, or a subsidiary, maybe even a board member. There are some serious challenges when it comes to that and perhaps your organizational structure doesn't give you the authority to directly address it. So sometimes it's interesting to discuss ways that you can address that challenge without some of the tools you typically have.

Speaker 1: 2:00

Yeah, and it can feel. It made me think about some of the situations that I've encountered in the past and it can feel in those moments so paralyzing because you just don't know what to do and it evokes so much emotion which really clouds your thinking. So I think this is a really important topic to just be mindful of, because in those moments dealing with somebody that does have influence, and if you do the wrong thing it can cause some pain along the way.

Speaker 2: 2:31

Sure, I mean these are challenging situations. I mean certainly your inability to influence. It's demoralizing, it causes some real anxiety and we all behave in different ways when it comes to that. But at the end of the day, like most of the challenges as leaders run into, the best way to address this is to have a plan and attack it head on, if you will, and address it really with the tools that you have. So I think, even if it's super challenging, I think we can offer some tips as to how you can take some proactive steps.

Speaker 1: 3:14

That sounds good. Maybe three things that we could pull from three.

Speaker 2: 3:19

I mean there's so many, but we have a hip parade. I think the first thing that I think about in a situation like this and I think this comes from just experience when dealing with somebody that's difficult is you really need to build a support structure, a support system of people around you to help you deal with that situation. It's always so much more comfortable when you know A you are not alone in this situation, that this person is truly challenging and also gives you insights and perspective as to how to deal with what the situation is. So often with these folks, they will get under your skin, they will berate you, they will gaslight you, and so it's suddenly really challenging to be objective, and so having those people who will either have your back or at least have a second set of eyes is super, super powerful. I always like to think that you can defend yourself when you're in the room, but your support system defends you when you're not in the room, and having a support system in this kind of scenario goes a long way.

Speaker 1: 4:23

Yeah, I love that and the context around that as well. And if you anticipate what the toughest questions are going to ask or the things that might hijack you, as long as you're ready for them, you'll be better. You'll be more clearheaded when something surprises you that causes emotion to cloud your judgment. So I think that's a really good. And sometimes we avoid it so we don't want to talk to other people, but that's the wrong approach. How can you? Get somebody else to help you, yeah.

Speaker 2: 4:58

Yeah, I think we've done several sessions and episodes about how to create trust, how to create a strong group, and a lot of that is through vulnerability, and this is a perfect opportunity for you to do a couple other things. They address the situation you have with an executive. That's challenging, but also build some rapport and camaraderie and strength within your team by bringing them into the situation. So, relationship building never let a good crisis go to waste, and this is a great way to build relationships.

Speaker 1: 5:31

So good, so good. Never let a crisis go to waste. Great portable, All right. What's number two?

Speaker 2: 5:39

I think the second one, too, is you have to examine the bigger picture. So oftentimes, when things are super challenging, maybe above and beyond the obnoxious, maybe behaving in a way that is really incongruent to the way that you would expect them to behave maybe it's not you Take a step back. There are times when they're frustrated with your organization. They're frustrated with this quarter's budget. There's a lot of situations that really may be outside of your control, and so you need to be mature, realize that maybe you are not the center of the situation or center of the problem, and realize that there's really nothing you can do. You can be professional, work through it, but realize that it may be something that you are not aware of.

Speaker 1: 6:27

Yeah, zooming out. I think about zooming out and being able to look at from a different. Like literally thinking about how do I see this from a different perspective is a good tactic to use, and then just seeing it from their side. Yeah, that's a really good one.

Speaker 2: 6:41

I think it goes back to the first topic, which are your first suggestions. You have to check with others. Does he behave like this person? Does he behave like that? Is she always this frustrated during meetings? No, just during finance meetings, oh, okay, so maybe it's about finance. Understanding the bigger picture gives you more opportunities to be successful, but also maybe take some of the pressure off of you to single-handedly address the problem.

Speaker 1: 7:04

Yeah, I think it's good. It makes me also think. When I went to Harvard, the one thing that they said was people that consider the interests of the other party for 30 seconds before you walk in have measurably better results. So if you can get yourself in their head even a little bit, that might illustrate to them that you're not just in your seat, you're understanding and pivoting a little.

Speaker 2: 7:27

Oh, and that's such a great piece of advice. I'm going to remember that statistic, but because I do think that so often we are focused on my slides, my presentation, my budget, my staff, my team and really it takes a tremendous amount of energy to take that 30 seconds and go okay, what's the expectation from their side? What is the point of view from their side? Great piece of advice. Yeah, I like that a lot.

Speaker 1: 7:52

Yeah, it can even give you the words to use because you're now reorienting yourself, so you don't even know the nuances that it can provide to you, the tools. So what's the third?

Speaker 2: 8:03

You know. The third one is really I'd like to remind people to pick your battles. So many of us are people pleasers. So many people, so many leaders, are type A, where they want to make sure that they are the best.

Speaker 2: 8:16

If your boss's boss is a jerk and doesn't like your message, maybe that's okay, right. There may not be any value in addressing that situation. Odds are pretty good. That problem is well outside of your ecosystem. If the president of the Southwest Division is a horrible individual but you only deal with them once in a while, then that's just the way it is. I do find that many people come to me for coaching about an individual relationship and it'll take a couple of sessions to get to the fact that this is just something that's bothering you. It may not be important and the truth is you need to move past it and we're talking about it because it's got into your skin, but it isn't really affecting your career. It's just affecting your pride and I think that sometimes we need to check our six and realize it's more about our ego than really what the longer-term strategy should be.

Speaker 1: 9:10

Yeah, I remember being in a. I was with a partner in a consulting firm. He and I were meeting with a guy he didn't know and the guy started throwing out facts and wanting to show his knowledge and the partner I was with went back and forth with this guy and I remember leaving that meeting it was not productive at all and the partner that I was with was like, wow, I let my ego get in the way. I didn't even.

Speaker 1: 9:39

I like he was kind of saying I didn't even see my like, something took over for me and I wish I could have like turned that off. Yeah, yeah, we get.

Speaker 2: 9:50

our ego is definitely getting away and whether it's in the moment or even after the fact, you know we have plenty of challenges and ensuring that you have a great relationship with somebody who is barely tangential to your ecosystem is probably not worth the energy.

Speaker 1: 10:07

Yeah, yeah and it. And I just want to make one more point too, because when I was thinking about that, that situation, that person was difficult, but he wasn't mean this. We're not just talking about people just being mean, that this can be really subtle. Let's not just think it's somebody, that's just you know, you notice and you're like that's the mean guy. This can be really subtle, passive, aggressive, yeah.

Speaker 2: 10:28

There could be very various ways that they can be non productive, I guess is a good way to describe that.

Speaker 1: 10:35

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 10:35

Whether it's being, whether they're a bully or whether they're, you know, silently ignoring you and deflecting or disregarding. You know that that behavior is, is you know it's non productive. The question is how do you address that?

Speaker 1: 10:51

Yeah, so good, all right. So what are the three? Bring us back.

Speaker 2: 10:55

So yeah, wrapping up, I think the first one is, you know, build a support system around you. Make sure you have some, some more eyes in the room to help you see it for what it is and also to get some, some clarity on the situation from from other points of view. Second, help that use that support system to get the bigger picture, examine it from a different point of view, look at it from their point of view, understand the situation so you can go in with a little objectivity. And then, third, you know, pick your battles. Realize that sometimes your ego is getting in the way and you're trying to resolve a situation or create a better relationship than is necessary, and that effort may not be worth it. In fact it could be detrimental.

Speaker 1: 11:38

Awesome, such great tips to handle difficult senior people. Thank you so much, james.

Speaker 2: 11:44

That's good stuff.

Speaker 1: 11:48

Hey, james, I was wondering if you had a superpower to enhance your leadership skills. What would it be and why?

Speaker 2: 11:58

God, that's a great question. You know, obviously the superpower of choice is always going. You know, if I could fly not really sure how flying is really going to enhance my leadership skills I think, ultimately, if I had a superpower that would help my leadership skills and help my team and my company do better, it would for me to be like the best possible communicator, so I would be able to 100% be heard and people to 100% hear what was being said.

Speaker 1: 12:34

So if I had a way to massively perfect communication.

Speaker 2: 12:39

I think that would be. You don't see that on Marvel there's not a lot of DC comics with the El Communicator. This is as the Choo-choo-choo, we whoops. I'm addicted. That would be my superpower.

Speaker 1: 12:54

Yeah, that's a good one. That's a good one. Thanks for listening to this week's episode of Quick Take, where we talk about the questions that are on the mind of executives everywhere. Connect with us and share what's on your mind.

Speaker 2: 13:09

You can find us on LinkedIn, youtube or whatever nerdy place on the internet. You find your podcasts. Our links to the show are in the show notes. We appreciate you.