Taming the Dragons That Hinder Brilliance

Have you ever found yourself at a boardroom table, staring down the barrel of an inflated ego threatening to derail your meeting—maybe even your business objectives? We have! But in today's episode, we're tearing off the mask to confront the 'hidden dragons' of ego head-on.

We share our own experiences and strategies for engaging these challenging personalities with honesty and a touch of humility, all while maintaining a collaborative spirit. It's a candid discussion that goes beyond the usual leadership advice, diving into the nitty-gritty of fostering environments where egos are checked at the door, and collective goals take center stage.

In this episode, we discuss the following:
1. How to recognize and acknowledge the presence of egos in the workplace.
2. Addressing egos through humble inquiry and open dialogue.
3. The importance of cultivating a culture that values shared success over individual heroism. 

This episode is sponsored by LucidPoint
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CONNECT WITH SUSIE:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/susietomenchok/

CONNECT WITH JAMES:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/capps/

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:15

Welcome to the Quick Take podcast, the show where you get targeted advice and coaching for executives by executives. I'm Suzy Tominczuk.

Speaker 2: 0:24

And I'm James Capps. Give us 15 minutes and we'll give you three secrets to address the complex topic of issues that are challenging executives like you today.

Speaker 1: 0:35

Hey, welcome to Quick Take. I'm your host, suzy, along with my co-host, james. How are you, james?

Speaker 2: 0:40

I am living the dream. I love that I love that.

Speaker 1: 0:46

I love this topic that I want to talk about today is about egos and I, through my career even you and I when we used to work together, I bet we could list like top five people that had egos and it came up for me this week because I had a client who was just frustrated about one of her peers who they'll come to a meeting and they'll be. They'll need to get, you know, the goal finished, and there's one of her peers that inevitably starts just kind of going on and on and on, and especially when their boss is in the room and just wanting to show how much he knows, and so it goes beyond the needs of the meeting and it's like exhausting. And so like, how do you deal with people that their ego gets in the way of business?

Speaker 2: 1:41

Yeah, it's super challenging. I mean, I think a lot of you know our upbringing and our on, our skills and the way that we are built as human beings. You know ego is what gets you through the day. You know you are successful in some cases because of that ego. And I think that challenge with this particular topic is you know, at some point you know your strength becomes your weakness and it's super difficult as a leader, as a peer, as an employee, to address that. And I think that this is a problem I've seen at every company I've worked with and worked for and partnered with and coached. It's a very, very common problem.

Speaker 1: 2:23

Yeah, I feel like sometimes to your point, it's like you're still trying to prove yourself. You want to prove yourself and I think sometimes our mindset. We need to really kind of observe ourselves and see if we're doing that, because I think that can get in our way too.

Speaker 2: 2:41

Well, and unfortunately, what I have seen is many of the real world examples related to this are articulated in the postmortem, where the egotistical doctor who was intimidating the nurses made a mistake during surgery, or a CEO a founder led startup, maybe with a CEO who thinks they know everything has a horrible product launch. After the fact, the realization is made and unfortunately, sometimes it's too late.

Speaker 1: 3:20

Well, and that makes me wonder. The only evidence that hindsight is 2020. So sometimes you believe that the person that has a really confident way of framing their advice, sometimes you don't want to push against it and so it's easy. Those two examples that you used it's the result went bad, but in the moment, what do you do about this ego and how do you temper it so that you don't run into bad outcomes?

Speaker 2: 3:53

Right, and I think about these. The first thing you need to do is you need to unmask that hidden dragon, acknowledge it for what it is, give it a name and say, look, this particular situation is unacceptable. And I don't mean to do it in a petty way or in a way that is water cooler chatter or just snarky. It is like all right, we have a problem with this particular employee. We need to address it, and I think the very first thing is identifying it as a real thing, because then you can as we all know, as leaders, then you can find a way to solve for it. But you have to acknowledge it. You know, do what it takes to get Input and validation from from outside, but you know, unmask that hidden dragon is gonna be the first piece of advice that I like to give so is it going to that person and giving them feedback, or does it just depend?

Speaker 2: 4:52

that's the second piece. No, you're good, but it's like really then? So you got to unmask that dragon, then you've got to tame that dragon right and I think that that is through, you know, a very thoughtful conversation. Humility, you know. I think a lot of this is really articulated in and Brené Brown's dare to lead brave leadership For tough times her book. She talks about advocating for that vulnerability, advocating the courage that is required to be a good leader. You know this is a. You know I think I was just reading an article the other day on HBR the dark side of leadership and dealing with hubris and how it impacts books, and I think that that, you know, having that conversation, having and creating a culture where that kind of a Humility and conversation can take can take place, I think is huge, because then you can address it a little more aggressively so.

Speaker 1: 5:56

So unmasking is at least just saying this is getting in our way, I'm gonna keep, I'm gonna kind of keep tabs on it, I'm gonna kind of observe it. And then the second is to call it out. And I just want to add too is when, when somebody has influence over that person, whether it is that there appear or there's high trust, that might be a good person to help that. Because if you're dealing with a big ego, you you might want to think about finesse, the finesse that you can have in approaching them, so that you have the best success.

Speaker 2: 6:31

Yeah, I think that that's the. That's the art of leadership here that the Brené talks about is you've got to go in there with a, with the fact that the ego is in mind, right, and that this is a challenging conversation, and you've got to go in there with a collaborative mindset. You got to say, look, we need to be better about this, whether it's through an Opportunity for them to learn or opportunity for you to learn, it's got a. You've got to find a way to address that with it. That individual. I'd be willing to bet box of donuts, though, that every single one of our listeners who is thinking about one individual At their, at their workplace, that individual has had this conversation happened before. Very rarely is somebody who's got the big ego has not been told that they have a big ego, has not been told they need to tone it down.

Speaker 2: 7:19

It's a matter of whether the the third step has been a direct take in my third piece of advice, which is the more a, more holistic, creating a culture of A different type of leadership. No, there's so much. We talk about servant leadership all the time, leading from behind. I can't even. I could go on on and on and on about, about the books and articles about that, that that approach is really what Brings people together. And If you've got a bully and you've sat down with that bully but you still have a hero network at your firm, your company still embraces and rewards that behavior, it's not going to change that third step, which is pivoting the way your culture behaves, rewarding the servant leadership, rewarding the people who are willing to be more vulnerable. That is when you can really move the needle.

Speaker 1: 8:11

Yeah, I think that's really key and it just also makes me think we also need to look at ourselves and in this, if you're listening to this, to your point about being leading from behind, are you taking up too much space? I often tell people to think about the cadence of the room that's going on around you, and if you identify that you're taking up two or three times more time than other people kind of understand, is that important here? Is that adding value? And I think sometimes we need a little bit of self-awareness, a little bit of zooming out and looking at how are we showing up as leaders.

Speaker 2: 8:51

Exactly right. Exactly right, I mean it's challenging because, at the end of the day, many of us have moved through the ranks because of our forward-leaning, very aggressive, willing to do what it takes to get it done. But servant leadership is about scale. It's about getting more done than you could possibly do. It's how do I get a team, an office, a building, a country to do something versus me doing it myself? And I think that that's where ego and humility come into play. So that's how work gets done and that's how great teams are formed, and don't forget us as leaders.

Speaker 1: 9:25

we're a work in progress, and when we Always work in progress.

Speaker 2: 9:28

Oh my gosh.

Speaker 1: 9:29

Then that's when we're not growing in the way. Always cringe If you look back and you don't cringe. You are not growing.

Speaker 2: 9:39

Boy, that's good, I need that bumper sticker All right.

Speaker 1: 9:42

So what are the three? What are the three?

Speaker 2: 9:44

I think that first one is you've got to absolutely unmask that hidden dragon, identify that individual. Second one is you got to tame that dragon. Use humble inquiry, use, cultivate openness with that person so you can get that feedback. And then, third, create a culture of shared success, serve in leadership, create an ecosystem where the hero is in as a celebrated but more about what the team does as a whole.

Speaker 1: 10:13

Yeah, and it may not be the one and done this, may take some coaching. It's a journey yeah, because it's a journey to, to unmask and really make this happen in a positive way. This is great.

Speaker 2: 10:26

Great topic. Hey Susie, I've been wondering for the past couple of months who have you spent more money on, your granddaughter or your dog?

Speaker 1: 10:37

Oh, that is so cruel. I have to be honest, it is my dog the most money. I think that's going to change over time. She's nine months old now, so I do think that there's going to be a change in time. But if I had to be completely honest, and honesty is the best policy it's honesty is the best policy? It would be. Charlie, thanks for listening to this week's episode of Quick Take, where we talk about the questions that are on the mind of executives everywhere. Connect with us and share what's on your mind.

Speaker 2: 11:15

You can find us on LinkedIn, YouTube or whatever nerdy place on the internet you find your podcasts or links to the show are in the show notes.

Speaker 1: 11:23

We appreciate you.