Should I Stay or Should I Go?

Ever find yourself humming The Clash's “Should I Stay or Should I Go” while thinking about your career future? Join us as we tackle the common dilemma of deciding whether to stay in your current job or pursue new opportunities. We'll share tips on staying objective during these critical moments and avoiding the scarcity mindset that can cloud your judgment.

We'll also reveal strategies to protect yourself from unexpected job layoffs and poor performance reviews. Our conversation is filled with practical advice on regularly assessing your career to ensure you're making strategic moves rather than being swept along by circumstances. Tune in for unfiltered, real-world insights that could be the career boost you've been looking for.

In this episode, we discuss the following:
1. Deciding whether to stay in a current job or move on to a new opportunity.
2. Job crafting to align career goals and personal interests.
3. Managing your departure from a job thoughtfully and professionally.

This episode is sponsored by LucidPoint
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CONNECT WITH SUSIE:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/susietomenchok/

CONNECT WITH JAMES:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/capps/

Transcript

Susie: 0:15

Welcome to the Quick Take podcast, the show where you get targeted advice and coaching for executives by executives. I'm Suzy Tominchuk.

James: 0:24

And I'm James Capps. Give us 15 minutes and we'll give you three secrets to address the complex topic of issues that are challenging executives like you today.

Susie: 0:35

Hey, welcome to Quick Take. I'm your host, Suie Tomlinson, along with James Capps. How are you, James?

James: 0:41

I am so excited to be here and not ready whatsoever. But we hit the button and away we go.

Susie: 0:48

Yeah, we don't like to miss those moments of inauthenticity. We want to be inauthentic right here, in front of everyone.

James: 0:57

Is that like a full spectrum?

Susie: 0:59

Like that is super authentic.

James: 1:01

I mean, it's so unauthentic, it's real.

Susie: 1:04

We're being very vulnerable right now. What I want to talk about today, what we should talk about today, is should I stay or should I go now? And this came up for me because I have a client.

James: 1:16

Is that a song?

Susie: 1:18

It is.

James: 1:19

I forget who sings that. Who is it?

Susie: 1:20

Clash.

James: 1:22

Ah, it's Clash. That's right, you knew, no, that would be Flash.

Susie: 1:28

Oh, it's Flash, Is that really?

James: 1:29

Well, that's Flash Gordon. Oh, that's right. You know what I need to stay on.

Susie: 1:33

You know what I need to stay on. I got to stay on task. People are going to get to know me behind the scenes. We don't want that to happen. So I had a client. She was a executive in an organization that that I'm trying to think about how to say this without giving too much information. So she led a whole department of people and they asked me to coach her because she was just not everybody under her was not really jiving with her, not really listening to her. And I was talking to her and she's like I don't really know why people don't like me, they don't trust me, I don't know what's going on. And there was such a disconnect. I kept thinking there she needs to make a decision to move on. It's just not the right fit. And she was really struggling with it because she just wanted so badly to make it work and she so badly wanted to be successful. And so she was just, month after month, just struggling around it.

Susie: 2:34

So I thought maybe, if that's a good example or not, around when is that time to make the decision to stay or go?

James: 2:43

Yeah, you know it is a challenging one, and I think that so often when I talk to people about career changes and really just trying to figure out if they're going to get what they want out of their career, it's how do I look at it objectively? I think that's the real ask is, what do I need to ask myself? How do I need to look at the situation? Because you do, a lot of us get emotionally involved in our careers. We spend a lot of time thinking about it, we spend a lot of time with our coworkers, and so to be objective and have the right mindset when you're kind of thinking about it is really challenging.

Susie: 3:20

Yeah, I think that's especially important when it becomes a really difficult situation around you, because you tend to get a scarcity mindset, where you're not thinking clearly anyway, and so like you said, zooming out or getting some clarity, getting some objectivity is super important, because you could make good and bad decisions, totally agree.

James: 3:44

Yeah, and I think that you know, certainly, when things are not going well, you do tend to start to ask yourself those questions. But at any point in your career, you know, no, no different than doing some sort of career assessment. Uh, at the beginning of your resetting your goals, um, at the beginning of the year, you should evaluate is this my last year here? Have I, has this run its course? And have those conversations with yourself. So you know you don't want to wait until you there's a layoff on the horizon or you had a lousy performance appraisal? You know you should look. I think you, you know you could, you, and I know you can wake up one day, having been somewhere for 12 years, and have no idea how it happened, and so I think it's just so important that you evaluate that.

Susie: 4:31

Yeah, and you also don't want to make very quick decisions. I remember for me, and you also don't want to make very quick decisions. I remember for me I was kind of getting to the end of a career and then a very specific situation happened that was highly emotional for me, where some people turned their backs on me and I went in the next day and I resigned because I was so mad and luckily, I worked for a boss that said I'm not going to accept your resignation until Monday, so take the weekend.

James: 4:55

And on said I'm not going to accept your resignation until Monday.

Susie: 4:56

So take the weekend, and on Monday I decided to stay. So luckily I had somebody that allowed me to at least make the decision objectively. I ended up leaving after a few weeks, but that can get in our way.

James: 5:10

Yeah, and I think you know that I'll jump in, and you know, I think the first thing that that I think people should do is really evaluate the cost, first and foremost, the cost of staying right.

James: 5:20

There is a the tenure tax I think is what it's called in higher education and and and there's just a lot of different ways to look at what a company can do for you to stay.

James: 5:29

You know, I I think of there's two leaders we talk a lot about, a lot about Jack Welsh and with, obviously, and Marissa Meyer, who is at Google. Marissa started really at a lower level in that company and worked her way up, and so the ideal situation for her was that she was allowed to spend time at that company. That loyalty was rewarded with, ultimately know, ultimately, a very senior role, you know, whereas Jack Welsh, he was a little different, you know, he was all about short-term goals, and so you were not rewarded for your tenure. It was more about what have you done for me this quarter? And so you need to look very effectively and very objectively at what the company rewards you with for your tenure, and in many cases, all it really is is more hours and a little bit of money, and so it's important for you to understand what the current employer is offering you for that long-term tenure.

Susie: 6:31

Are you saying that if there's not a high value there for you, that that should be the first decision point to leaving?

James: 6:40

You know I think there's a good Forbes article I was reading the other day and I think it was called when Tenure's Not Enough. You know, and what does you know? What is the executive's or not tenure? What is when loyalty is not enough, when your loyalty is not enough to keep your tenure moving? And I think it's really the evolving nature of how the C-suite and the executive leadership was treated and that, ultimately, that you need to evaluate how it's going to be rewarded.

Susie: 7:09

Yeah, and maybe also can the reward be beyond what we. That comes to mind automatically our title and compensation. I mean reward can be some other intangibles or not intangibles. Tangible things like development and feeling productive. It can be anything. It can be anything.

James: 7:27

I mean your ideal situation could be flexibility. I mean, you know so it isn't really about. You know the classics, but I do think that if you are sitting at the beginning of the year and you are doing a sort of a self-assessment, you have to think about what you want in your career and whether or not you're going to be able to get that at your current company, and whether they reward uh, if you stay there you're staying there Will you get those things?

Susie: 7:55

Yeah.

James: 7:56

And I think that's the first question to ask is what happens if I stay?

Susie: 8:00

Yeah, and what I like about that is getting that clarity from time to time, even if you're not even thinking about leaving. It gives you that you've kind of thought it through.

James: 8:10

if it is or if it's not.

Susie: 8:11

I like that a lot because it kind of helps you understand where you are on the map.

James: 8:16

Well, and I think the second piece of advice, which is just like that, is okay. So I've done the self-assessment, I've kind of checked out what's going on here. Can I then do something about that to create an opportunity here? Because maybe the company, your role, your department, your organizational structure isn't really going to reward your loyalty. Your department, your organizational structure isn't really going to reward your loyalty. Maybe, looking at that as a growth mindset where you can do things within the company that will get you to where you want to be. So I think we have talked about job crafting. We have talked about how you can start to evolve things to make your career a little more in line with what you want.

James: 8:57

And I think that you know, I know I worked with an executive who was working at you know a company and was struggling, and then he decided that he will. Well, he knew that he wanted to be part of more of innovation, and so he stood up an innovation lab. So he you know the company wasn't going to get into that space within his organization. He decided that he should. You know he could create that through working with his leadership team and saying, hey, I want, what I will really get me going is to be part of this lab. So he, he took the initiative and and took the growth mindset and created the opportunity.

Susie: 9:35

Yeah, it's, it's being that, it's having that entrepreneurial spirit within an organization.

James: 9:41

Yeah, yeah.

Susie: 9:42

Entrepreneurship, as they call it.

James: 9:45

Yes, exactly right, exactly right.

Susie: 9:46

Yeah, um, and also I, and I also like your idea that you always say that your default is always me say yes to any opportunity. So, even having that as an additional, if you're not clear where you want to go, be, have a growth mindset and be a little bit uncomfortable and say yes before you're ready.

James: 10:06

Right, right and then, and then. The third thing I want to talk about is what you have decided to go Right and, and then what?

Susie: 10:16

Yeah.

James: 10:17

And I was. I was literally talking to a consultant the other day um that, um, his, um, his, his company, uh, is specifically designed to help the executive craft his exit plan, his reputation management, um, and exit interview coaching, huh, interesting. So what they're doing, the value of this is to ensure that, as you leave, you're leaving on top, no matter what.

Susie: 10:48

Yeah.

James: 10:49

Even if your numbers are down, even if you're going through some sales slumps, technology slumps, maybe you've had some sort of product recall that you're going to get blamed for, you can still manage it. And so what? What really what this firm is doing and this consultancy, and what I'm suggesting is that once you make the decision that you are done, be thoughtful on how you go, because at the end of the day, we all know it's a small world and so many of us have crossed paths with so many of the others that we've worked with. You know I always tell people who have worked for me that I'll probably work for them someday, and I'm completely fine with that, that it's just the nature of the beast, and so going out effectively and in a thoughtful manner cannot be understated.

Susie: 11:39

Yeah, red carpet. I've worked for a company that says red carpet in, red carpet out also. Oh brilliant. Yeah, mindset around that as an internal as well, right.

James: 11:52

Yeah, yeah, boy, I like that a lot, but I think that's that's just a great way to think about it, because so many times we start looking at our next opportunity or the tragedy of us being forced to go. But that time of changing your point of view, I think, is critical.

Susie: 12:08

Yeah, all right. So what are the three?

James: 12:11

First, take a look at the tenure tax. Evaluate what is the cost of you staying. Am I going to get what I need by staying here and do I need to consider going? And if you do feel like you've got some things going for you, try job crafting. Try to create a situation where you can use the growth mindset to find that same track that you want to see elsewhere. Maybe you can find it where you are. And then, as you so well said, susie, red carpet in, red carpet out, craft your exit. Make sure that you do it. If you decide you need to do it, do it in a way that is very positive and ensure that it only builds your reputation and your career.

Susie: 12:53

Yeah, such an important thing to think about, because usually we don't take the time to really get our mindset right.

James: 13:01

Yeah, and I think about you know I talked to a lot of our friends that are in consultancies and in those shops where you know you're there for nine months or six months and then you leave. You know the exit is very important because you know the companies spend millions of dollars with your consultancy and if you walk away with a half-finished three-ring binder and a half-eaten sandwich, you know your reputation isn't going to be such that they'll bring you back or hire you again and so that exit, you got to think it through.

Susie: 13:29

So true, so valuable. Thank you, james.

James: 13:33

Good stuff.

Susie: 13:37

James, when you were 10, what did you think you were going to be when you grew up?

James: 13:42

You know, I always thought I'd be an engineer, because that's what my dad was.

Susie: 13:48

Okay.

James: 13:55

But I think that over the years, you know, I think the being an engineer went from being like the guy that drives the train all the way up to somebody who actually writes software. So I think that that was just a great way to get people to quit asking because nobody really knew what that was. So you want to drive trains? No, the other kind. Oh, okay, cool yeah.

Susie: 14:14

That is a pretty general category. That is a really general category. I mean it could be an engineer of a train at like an amusement park.

James: 14:22

That would be great and that is my goal, still to this day. Lakeside, if you have an opening, call me. I want to drive that train.

Susie: 14:30

I love that train.

James: 14:32

It's still there.

Susie: 14:34

It is, does it actually go around?

James: 14:36

Oh, hell, yeah, yeah.

Susie: 14:38

Wow.

James: 14:40

I guess I haven't been.

Susie: 14:41

Oh, I think you are smoking something.

James: 14:44

That may be true, but the train is still there, okay.

Susie: 14:50

Thanks for listening to this week's episode of Quick Take, where we talk about the questions that are on the mind of executives everywhere. Connect with us and share what's on your mind.

James: 14:59

You can find us on LinkedIn, youtube or whatever nerdy place on the internet. You find your podcasts. Our links to the show are in the show notes. We appreciate you.